GR Comment: “Hunt has an ‘obligation to deliver on a promise’?
FFS I’ve heard it all now!
General Election 2015: 50 promises the Conservatives have broken since they came to power
They don’t usually have a problem with breaking promises, why is this one so important?
Because they want to privatise the NHS maybe?”
GW: TCs break 50 election promises in 50 days?
GR Comment: “I cannot negotiate about a promise we made in a manifesto. I have an obligation to deliver that manifesto.”
Don’t hide behind that. You either agree with what you are doing or you don’t. Don’t blame manifestos.
If you don’t agree with the policy you are meant to try to put through, have some guts, say so and resign.
If you do agree with that policy, have some guts, be clear and go into battle with junior doctors and those who support them (including some who voted for you).”
GR Comment: “All year around parliament? Heavens above! There are well over 600 rubber stamps stashed on the green benches – sponging off the taxpayer and daddy whilst interfering in detail, things that are of no business of theirs. ‘Look I am doing something’, JHC, all year around I would reduce their numbers to 4 per county or agreed region and sack the rest within the no contract rules.”
GR Comment: “This Government has broken manifesto promises aplenty since May. I’m sure we won’t notice another one gone west. This man insults our intelligence.”
GR Comment: “So the Tories cannot negotiate on a manifesto promise about 24-hour NHS, but it’s fine to cut Tax Credits when they promise not to.”
GR Comment: “Now who should I trust? A rabid right winger who has co-authored a book calling for the NHS to be replaced by a new health care provision “system”, a person who breached parliamentary “expenses” standards and likes avoiding tax through accounting tricks (£100k according to the Daily Torygraph!) and represents the stock broker belt in parliament…
…or thousands of young doctors.
(See wikipedia for further sordid details)”
GR Comment: “How about working out how to deliver a promise before promising it? In the world of private business so idolised by the Tory party you’d have got the sack if you’d got hired on the basis of something you actually didn’t know how to do.”
GR Comment: “Jeremy *unt’s Maths
11% pay rise + 20-30% pay cut = 11% pay rise
GW: About as good as G Osborne (Deg Mod Hist)’s Maths
GR Comment: “I’m all for a 24 hour NHS … but to get 24 hour care at the same level as we currently have 5 days a week will require a 2 fifth increase in the operational budget. Its simple maths.
Okay so it’s not quite 2 fifths increase because some of those costs are there anyway … but if you are currently paying for a consultant for 5 days a week and the other 2 days there is no consultant, it doesn’t take a genius to work out that you are going to have 2 extra days pay to get out of your budget.
You just can’t “announce” a 24 hour 7 days a week NHS while expecting costs to go down.
And its something that takes time, either you persuade a lot of nurses and doctors to come from other places, or you have to train them – again costing money.”
GR Reply: “You are assuming a level of management competence which appears not to exist.”
GR Comment: “We have a real problem here. Private hospitals do not train doctors and do not have the costs that NHS Trusts incur training all NHS staff including nurses. The money we the public invest in training is lost when our highly trained staff emigrate. They are wanted all over the world. We hear complaints that if we do not pay our bankers and senior executives massive salaries they will go so we do. But not doctors! We have managed with a 5 day a week full service all this time. The Ministry of Health is a 5 day a week service, almost every service was. A&E was not but many went with routine complaints at weekends because their work places have been difficult for some time over doctor appointments in working time. That is what is wrong. Quite what mandate Hunt thinks he has to do what he is doing is unclear but the Free Trade talks in the EU will do for the NHS and BBC yet are not reported at all and this is what this is all building up to. Surely the editors and journalists realise that.” They do but are just told to “shut up or else” and they do that is why we call them LSM (Lame Stream Media).
GR Comment: “What about breaking the 2015 Conservative manifesto commitment that from April 2016 individuals would be liable only for the first £72,000 of care home fees with the state stepping in to pay the rest. This demarche was announced about ten weeks after the gen election by Alistair Burt – a minister in Hunt’s department.”
GR Comment: “We should have a 24-hour, 7-days-a-week, all year round Parliament.” GR Reply: “With MPs on minimum wage, zero hours contracts!” GR Reply: “And drunk members of the public puking on them at weekends.” GW: Take away MP’s £450pm food allowance which is costing the taxpayer too much. After all medics’ breaks are to be reduced under this new contract so why not reduce MP breaks and food money as well?
GR Comment: “Jeremy, your colleague David Cameron doesn’t seem too bothered about breaking promises. Follow his example.” http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2015/oct/29/manifesto-promise-broken-general-election-david-cameron-child-tax-credits
GR Comment: “The problem with the reasoning is a key premise of the argument. Namely – “The NHS is more dangerous at weekends, so there is no doubt that some reform is needed.” The study that shows this to be ‘true’ had to divide the week into Tue-Thu and Fri-Mon in order to find a fifteen percent worst outcome after 30 days (a fairly contorted set of conditions that are often found in such statistical fishing trips). Hunt, and the wider government, like ‘metrics’ (they mean things that can be counted but they want to give an impression that those measurements gain some inherent validity because they call them ‘metrics’) as it allows them to claim ‘evidence-based’ (they mean based on evidence but again use jargon to add false importance to their point) policy and that they are right. The same study actually found Wednesday to be the day you are most likely to die in hospital, that is how silly this approach is.”
GW: Look you are giving Mr Runt far too much credit. Mr Runt doesn’t understand any of this. He is simply the PR messenger puppet. I doubt Mr Runt has any STATS quals at all.
Hello? Is that Mr/Mrs/Ms/Mstr/Herr/Frau/ GW? Who is this? I won’t take up too much of your time. Are you wanting to talk about Jeremy Hunt? No I just would like to ask. I’m sorry if you are not talking about how awfull J Hunt is I’m afraid I am going to have to hang up. Goodbye. Fleeep.
GR Comment: “Nothing would make the Tories happier than junior doctors being so demoralised they run into the arms of better-paying private healthcare companies run by Tory donors.
Or if the quality of the health service becomes worse, so more patients turn to healthcare companies run by Tory donors. I take my hat off to the honorable ones who stay on in the name of public service rather than greed.”
GR Comment: Jeremy You are playing with fire if you alienate all our young and expensively trained Doctors. Sit down and talk to them with your ears doing twice the work of your mouth!”
GR Comment: “I asked to see a GP doctor, any doctor, any time as soon as possible. Three days and one albeit, small, heart attack later I received one. The Tory manifesto is a lie unless the number of GP’s and backup is being increased rather than being spread even even more thinly over seven days. I can expect a man who has declared his moral position so firmly, will, if the Osborne obsession continues to override this manifesto, resign not just from this cabinet but this Conservative Party that has lost its way.”
GR Comment: “The mandate which the Tories received from 24% of the electorate can be forgotten at will, as tax credits demonstrate. Hunt dragging out this feeble excuse simply shows the poverty of his argument, such as it is.”
GR Comment: “I cannot negotiate about a promise we made in a manifesto. I have an obligation to deliver that manifesto.”
Of course you can. Nobody read the manifesto anyway apart from a few journalists. Lets be honest here, you are not going to deliver this manifesto promise;
delivering annual net migration in the tens of thousands, not the hundreds of thousands
the best country in the world for developing maths, engineering, science and computing skills
and don’t get me started on this one;
running a surplus so that we start paying down our debts”
GR Comment: “He added: “We want to be able to promise all NHS patients that they can be confident that whatever day of the week they are admitted to hospital they are offered the same high quality NHS care.”
As far as I can see it, and from personal experiences of A&E and maternity services (used at all hours, both our kids were born in the early hours of the morning), the standard of care was absolutely outstanding. So this argument is horseshit.”
An Unrhymed Ode to the ToriCons
GR Comment: “It seems there comes a point in every generation where, unfortunately, they have to learn the hard way that the tories cannot change their spots and are serial offenders. I have always believed that people can change individually but they are an ideology. They may sound good, they may look good, but they cannot do good. No sooner are the words out of their mouths then they go away and do the exact opposite. This is the great dilemma for them because no matter how much they spin the truth they cannot actually, when push comes to shove, tell the truth or deliver on a promise. It’s ingrained throughout them, like a stick of rock, they can’t help it, they are programmed to destroy us. It’s not their fault, it’s their nature, they are like Manchurian candidates. Unfortunately they are yet again in government because some people have short-term memory problems and/or a desire to believe them despite all the evidence. Even I listen to them sometimes and think they sound sincere. It’s a neat trick. Don’t fall for it junior doctors. To keep believing them and expecting them to be honest is a sure sign of having worked too many hours and having impaired judgement. I implore the junior doctors to take them on, stand up for yourselves, give these bullies a bloody nose they won’t forget for when they next get elected, further down the line, in order to save what’s left of OUR NHS for the next generation.”
GR Sorting out ToriTroll: “They’ve certainly added more and more layers of administration but the frontline services have not got bigger or better.”
GR Comment: “Manifesto promises are meaningless to these airbrushed, photoshopped (yesterday’s poppies for instance) politicians. The only doctors they’re concerned about are their spindoctors.”
GR Comment: “Hunt’s learnt the art of negotiation from Bojo the clown dealing with the RMT union.”
GR Comment: “Yet the mendacious Tories seem happy to “negotiate” their promise not to cut Tax Credits.” GR Reply: “Until the Lords got involved, at which point they didn’t want to negotiate any further and called it an affront to democracy. Funny that.”
GR Comment: “Like the Tory mandate not to cut tax credits. He’s ruined his political career – time to take a CEO job at a private health firm.”
GR Comment: “Why? TCs haven’t kept any other promises have they?
- Care Act provisions for finances – postponed 4 years, 3 weeks after being in office
- Tax Credits – cut, despite repeated promises to the contrary.
- The economy…well, that’s a bit too embarrassing for Gideon
- Benefits – IDS has still failed, and is still on target to fail, on every promise made over Universal Credit.
Tories – the gits that just won’t give.”
GR Comment: “Just shorten that soundbite, Jeremy. “I cannot negotiate”. There, fixed it for you.”
GR Comment: “Didn’t seem to have any problems with dumping a manifesto promise for ‘no top down reorganisation of the NHS’.”
GR Comment: “A manifesto promise they mean to keep! That would be a first. Only 11.3m out of a voting population of 46m voted Tory.”
GR Comment: “He’s a nasty bit of work that Jeremy Hunt. I was at a conference a few years ago where he was booed by midwives – it was great – I kind of wanted him to walk into the crowd so I could watch them tear him limb from limb – he is utterly out of his depth – that’s the thing isn’t it – get someone in a post who doesn’t really understand and they’ll do any old rubbish and believe it.”
Why don’t they trust Hunt?
GR Comment: “They are intelligent people, highly trained at analysing information to reach conclusions about the correct course of action resulting in improved health.
Considering Hunt more dangerous than the Ebola virus is hardly the most difficult diagnosis.”
GR Comment: “Smacks of desperation with 24 hours to go until the BMA ballot. Only natural I suppose when you’re a health secretary facing the first industrial action by doctors in forty years, hardly good CV material.”
GR Comment: “In order to apparently bring this promise to fruition it seems he is going to alienate the doctors and nursing staff and run the NHS down, already there’s a funding shortfall and several Trusts have gone into special measures. When he fails – and that’s looking increasingly likely his competence won’t be called into question”
GR Comment: “I really object to this ghastly slur on morons and cretins!
What have they done to be bracketed with J Hunt?” Ouch.
GR Reply: I really object to this ghastly slur on morons and cretins!
What have they done to be bracketed with J Hunt?
“There are very few cretins, as doctors have known about and treat thyroid and iodine deficiency for almost a hundred years. Babies are screened. Morons, however, are not treatable, and have to seek solace and support in the Tory Party”
GR Comment: “A vague aspiration, a soundbite wheeled out in a desperate bid to garner more votes – a proposal unexamined, unaccounted and not thought seriously through – is now written in stone and must be backhandedly implemented in a way which will make things worse. Classic Tories. It ain’t broke so they’re going to fix it, by destroying it. This has bugger all to do with the vague 24/7 idea and everything to do with hammering the NHS by reducing funding again. The spin is pathetic, that by reducing funding, alienating all the key workers, and handing huge chunks over to private profit we will get a ‘better’ health service. Magic thinking by Hunt who, like his cronies, masks the real intentions of this wrecking, vindictive, incompetent, shambolic government.” Hunt Hatred fosters huge increase of creative talent in UK via Blogs, UTube Vids, Facebook, Twitter.
Jeremy Hunt in Panto?
GR Comment: “The Panto season starts already. “Oh yes you Can but you can’t” do it on the cheap with empty sound bites. Broken promises are your Government’s Stock-in-trade. Just the same as “I will cut the deficit Not the NHS”. “There will be no cuts to Tax Credits.”
I’m waiting for the Classic “there’s the pot of Money there is no more”, get your leaders to divy it out and cop the Blame.
Creative accountancy – “rehash the offer” and the “fairy godfather can give an 11% pay rise that works out as a pay cut”. Meanwhile the Jnr doctors are looking for the exit to pastures new that pay more. We all know “the evil Lord Gideon is pulling the strings”. He’s behind you. Same Panto but few are smiling. The jokes are old ones repeated so often as failure after disappointment carries on.”
GR Comment: says he has obligation
Molluscs. They backtrack and U turn constantly. How does this differ?”
GR Comment: “Well, the MP’s did not have to do anything for their pay rise, it was imposed on them despite their ‘protests’. No extra hours or duties.”
GR Comment: “Firemen work a few days on and a few days off to recover. Doctors in A&E should do the same.” GR Reply: “There are not enough doctors to enable rotating shifts.”
GR Comment: ‘Mr Hunt, Dr Shipman is ready to see you now…’
GR Comment: “We all pay taxes for a service which we expect to be delivered at the right time. This is a service under extreme pressure right now because of cuts, mainly. The cuts are at their heart – just like all the austerity measures – completely unnecessary. They form part of a backbone to strip the State bare. Private service providers would just want to make a profit, because that is how capitalism works. That is wrong. All of that is the backdrop for what Hunt is trying to do here. The current government want the NHS to fail and they know that these changes to junior doctor contracts will help that along the way. A junior doctors life – and I know this from first hand experience having been out with one – is extremely challenging. Sometimes doctors don’t sleep much more than a few hours in 72 hour long shifts over weekends. They do it tirelessly, because they want to help and save lives. Lots of people work hard, but the pressure on a doctor is not just that they need to do a good job, but that if they don’t someone could lose their life. I think this government are criminals.”
GR Comment: “So let’s take account of the claims here:
- The pay offer will be revenue neutral
- No doctors will lose pay
- 75% of doctors will see their pay increasing
Lord above, Hunt knows even less about maths than he does about health.”
GR Comment: “Hunt is a stupid schoolboy—-we all know that to expect weekday style service at weekends would require a 40% increase in NHS funding.”
GR Comment: “Rather than training more doctors the government have actually reduced the number of places at Medical Schools, who aren’t happy about it. They’ve also reduced training places in hospital specilaties in the hope of forcing newly-qualified doctors to become GPs instead. Neither of these is compatible with their stated goal of expanding weekday services to cover the weekend as well.”
GR Comment: ” Gove, Hunt,and Osborne have made people’s lives a misery. From teachers, doctors, the vulnerable and many more they are despised like no others before them.”
GR Comment: Genuine question – how long can one expect to be a junior doctor, in the main?
“Seven to ten years. It was longer in the past (I did quite well to become a consultant ten years after graduating in medicine but it is now pretty common).
Pay: because of the banding for out-of-hours work it’s unpredictable, the more so as Foundation Trusts tend to “game” the banding to control costs. The basic figures are here.
Promotion: it’s still a pretty competitive process to be appointed a consultant, and the pay rises less than you would think (and far less than the Daily Mail thinks).”
GR Comment: I hope the BMA continue to whip this pathetic little weasel-face into shape. #supportournhs; #supportourjuniordoctors; Russell Howard https://twitter.com/russellhoward/status/657557211628093440
GR Comment: “Either way, Mr Hunt is going to find that junior doctors present a much sterner test than the countries poorest and most vulnerable which is the prefered prey of this government”
GR Comment: “Both Gaddafi and Assad commanded more popular support than this neo nazi regime”
GR Comment: “I was amazed, when my wife went into labour on a friday evening (and gave birth on the sunday) to find that a veritable horde of squatters had broken into the hospital, put on the staff uniforms, trained themselves, and were performing all the duties you would normally expect of staff in a manned hospital.
Now THAT’s care in the community!”
GR Comment: “Everyone who works in the public sector wants to serve their country – that does not mean that they are happy to be shafted daily by this neo nasty regime”
GR Comment: “It’s sad that Junior Doctors are potentially being driven to strike but they have my support whatever they decide to do. This government have proved, through the tax credits shambles, that they will always try and repackage losses as gains despite all the evidence pointing to the contrary so no one should be taken in by this 11% ‘rise’.”
GR Comment: “I can think of one, ‘greenest government ever’ and then all the renewable subsidies taken away.”
GR Comment: “And the latest broken pledge: Fracking in National Parks looks like it is going to be permitted now, following a commitment not to. The fracking companies won’t be able to make enough money if it isn’t allowed, apparently.”
GR Comment: “Hunt has seriously questionable motives. Have look at the arrangement he has with his cousin Virginia.”
GR Comment: The health secretary said he hoped junior doctors “would honour and respect the mandate” the Conservatives had been given by the British people.
Couldn’t this be applied in other areas?
- Home Secretary hopes that foreigners “honour and respect” the manifesto commitment to reduce immigration and stop trying to come here.
- Secretary of State for Work and Pensions hopes that poor people “honour and respect” manifesto commitment to reduce the deficit and go home and die.
- Secretary of State for Energy and Climate Change hopes National Grid “respect and honour” manifesto commitment to keep the lights on and finds more energy from somewhere, anywhere, to Make It So.
Shouldn’t Hunt have thought a bit before the election about how he was actually going to keep this promise before making it, rather than whining afterwards?”
Troll: “As to the 24% it’s actually 36% mandate”. GR Reply: “Population of the UK iro 65 million Tory Votes iro 11 Million ok it’s nearer to 17% happy now!”
GR Comment: “26% of a vote (where only 66% voted) is not a mandate”
Ministers want to scrap the complicated banding system, which builds up earnings based on responsibilities, hours worked and how often doctors are on call.
– “Sounds like a copy and paste from the Tory press release. Banding is eminently fair. Isn’t it appropriate that pay is related to responsibility and hours worked? Hunt’s “11% rise” is still a cut after banding has been altered or scrapped altogether.
Why aren’t journalists seeing this?”
“Why is The Guardian obediently trotting out the Tory line with no meaningful challenge or analysis?
Are you new here?”
GR Comment: “I think the junior doctors would be well within their rights to give some anatomically precise advice as to where exactly Hunt could insert his offer.
This business of not breaking a manifesto promise, though – hilarious. Every time I think they’ve gone beyond the reach of satire, these f*****s manage to lower the bar. I would shake my head in dazed amusement were it not for the fact that everything they do is so damaging.”
GR Comment: Sarah Wollaston MP @sarahwollaston tweet
“Briefing journalists before negotiating team, really, when trying to resolve a tense dispute?”
“Even his own parliamentary colleagues (well at least those with a soul) think this is a s*** way to negotiate. It was difficult to imagine a worse Health Secretary than Andrew Lansley but the total Hunt has managed the seemingly impossible.”
GR Comment: “I read the transcript of the debate in Parliament (I was sent the link because I supported the petition).
I note that the Hunt, when time for the debate was short, tried to use the death of Mr Robinson at Stafford hospital nearly ten years ago as a ‘look. squirrel’, implying that it was a failure of Labour (which it wasn’t – it was a failure of one doctor in A&E, and was most notable for the hospital’s efforts to cover it up, which wasn’t a national government problem either. I wonder if he will therefore accept responsibility for this, which occurred under his watch.
For my money, neither are national government failures, and neither are related to the junior doctor problem, but if he thinks different….?”
GR Comment: “The really funny part of the Debate was when two or three new intake Stooges read pre-prepared Scripts from the the Govt. and clearly did not understand what they were reading!”
GR Comment: “What about the election commitments that his lying, weasel of a leader made? But suddenly they cannot be broken? GR Reply: “It’s a la carte obligations”
Nov 5, 2015
U-turn on junior doctors, tax credits & MPs pay – are Tories now completely out of touch?
Where IS the Cameron GlovePuppet by the way?